Usernotes - when?

It was kind of assumed robber was gathering any usernotes possible that said offensive stuff to people on ttc. anyone know how that's going?

she hasn't. :l

would be cool if she gathered a bunch of offending usernotes.

then it'd be beneficial to have a nice chat with batleth

Batleth is actually one of the good admins, he's just kind of helplessly has to go along with what all the other admins want.

If you want to bitch to somebody it should be Nick seeing as he's in charge of everything.

Also... I imagine Lucy is loyal to her position. She didn't become a mod so she could be a dick and tell on them, rather, I'm pretty sure she became a mod to become a mod. And one of the requirements is being able to keep a secret.

Secondly, I don't think we should force those secrets out of her because it's just not very nice. I know how it feels. My brother interrogates me sometimes. Well, that's not how he sees it -- from his point of view he's simply asking a question, but I don't like how invasive and forceful he is about it at times.

That being said, usually when he asks me those kind of questions it turns out answering them honestly was the right thing to do anyways. This is not the case here. We're not asking Lucy questions because it's for the best, we're trying to extract information from her for gossip purposes which is pretty petty when you think of it that way.

Raxz wrote:Batleth is actually one of the good admins, he's just kind of helplessly has to go along with what all the other admins want.

If you want to bitch to somebody it should be Nick seeing as he's in charge of everything.

Also... I imagine Lucy is loyal to her position. She didn't become a mod so she could be a dick and tell on them, rather, I'm pretty sure she became a mod to become a mod. And one of the requirements is being able to keep a secret.

Secondly, I don't think we should force those secrets out of her because it's just not very nice. I know how it feels. My brother interrogates me sometimes. Well, that's not how he sees it -- from his point of view he's simply asking a question, but I don't like how invasive and forceful he is about it at times.

That being said, usually when he asks me those kind of questions it turns out answering them honestly was the right thing to do anyways. This is not the case here. We're not asking Lucy questions because it's for the best, we're trying to extract information from her for gossip purposes which is pretty petty when you think of it that way.

Being loyal to being a mod on TTC can be related to being loyal to hunting animals. You're killing the souls of innocent young ones! While I don't think forcing her is what we're doing, but really, we have been treated like complete bullshit by the mods of Toontown Central. Few have never been total dicks towards us.

It is not gossip as much as just being able to know all the shitty things the mods have ever said, because I'd like to have a moment someday to express to them how scummy they really are. I mean, Robber, Van, Garf, they were all fine. Obviously if I ever made my thoughts on the matter clear I'd be sure to note there are exceptions that include some of the greatest people I've met on this place you call the internet. I don't imagine I should be bitching to Nick since he's not the one that makes the shitty admin decisions, hell, he has little to do with the site besides the bills. Just saying - for someone who wasted a whole lot more time on TTC than you did, my friend, these people are assholes. It's like having sympathy for the devil. Speaking of which...



And on the statement of, she signed up to be a mod to be a mod, I can see where you're coming from, but I think EVERYONE signed up. I would've if I hadn't been banned. I think some of the people were more of like, "...Oh fuck, really?" and had to go with it. I mean, Mac Fiddlefuddy was willing to give Jeremy a usernote or two, and we barely know the guy. One of our Yahoo best friends ever ever ever I'd suspect would have SOME will since, unless you're David Lee Roth and Eddie Van Halen, I'd think it's hard to like running with the devil.

You do have some points there.

But one thing I would like to point out, I saw one of the mods actually explaining themselves one time, like years ago. They said that not all of them even necessarily agree with the rules, but they're enforcing them anyways because they all have to adhere to Nick's wishes.

That being said, that doesn't mean they're always interpreting those wishes correctly. It's just like people who do extremely bullshit things and say they're doing it in Jesus' name as an excuse.

However, bitching to the bullshitters won't get you anywhere, you have to bitch to the person who regulates the bullshitters so he can make them stop. It's like telling a hound to stop attacking you -- it'll most likely only listen to its owner.

Hence why I suggest we should inform Nick that he needs to keep his admin and mod team in line, maybe check up on them more often. Or if what they're doing is actually the way he wants the site run, well then the situation is pretty much just hopeless.

True, true. Nick did not set up a very proper foundation and is too busy making the servers smoke doobies on Twitter to care it seems...

Raxz wrote:If you want to bitch to somebody it should be Nick seeing as he's in charge of everything.

Nick? Do shit?
Please, I don't think I've ever seen him post anything in the time I've been there.

I believe the damage is already done, despite us having not done anything. ttc is going to spiral down in an irreversible collapse of activity, because the ones who have been bringing the activity are all gone. there's nothing the mods can do about that. but there's something beyond that, something that would make me feel a bit more triumphant if the mods knew we'd been on to them hiding usernotes from the people on ttc. the reason I would talk to batleth is because I feel like if I talk to someone like, say, beaniemooch they'd ban me for mod trolling even if I were kind. batleth is almost the only mod/admin on the site to have any real logic, and I feel like he'd be the kind of person who would actually listen and not shoo me off for arguing.

who knows, maybe I could even get him to alert the other mods and admins that what they've been doing is wrong. But it first starts with the usernotes, because it would be the first definite proof against the mods that what they've been doing is wrong. yes, I can argue with individual cases where users were mistreated, but that kind of argument feels almost baseless to me. starting with the usernotes it would feel a bit like an actual score against the whole dictatorship of a forum.

We need to remember that were were also backstabbers about a year ago (for example, the fake rollie account), so we could be seen as hypocritical in a way. But in our defence, we're immature teenagers who own a site for the hell of it, whilst the TTC mods are supposed to be mature adults who take responsibility of a huge fansite, made up of an average of 10 year olds.

The unfair bans are their loss, and because some of us on BURRRR are the main story/comic pioneers, we're role models - so if we go, hopefully so will our followers (especially the obsessive ones). I actually can't wait to post the leaving thread that I made, but I need to get the timing exactly right (when there are no visible mods on).

I also agree with Smart. I don't know Batleth very well but he seems like an okay staff member. Hopefully he can show the other mods that they are doing wrong.

Another argument I plan to use - for many of the bans people receive on the site, parents would NEVER ground their kids for, even if they were talking about it in front of younger siblings (with the exception of hacker discussion, personal info, spamming, etc but that's different). I highly doubt the mods ever run in their heads whether the average parent would ground their kids for saying certain things. Also, it seems like they're downright lazy when they ban all posting of things like being conceived because it MIGHT invoke a non-G rated topic... seems rather irresponsible that they would ban someone for even mentioning something that MIGHT lead to a mature topic. Does the strictest parent ground their child for simply stating the idea of being born? no

guys okay look I'm sorry for not getting usernotes because you guys told me to.

First off, it's over. I'm no longer a mod. It's actually A LOT of stress and I couldn't handle it all with the other major things in my life. so no hope of usernotes from me now, sorry.

Secondly, thank you so much to Raxz. I didn't become a mod to start anything scandalous.

I had an agreement when I agreed to be a mod. I said I could keep secrets. That I would follow rules and be a good role model. And that I would make sure other people did, too. All of those things, I did.

If I broke the rules and gave out everything, wouldn't that make me as bad as you say all the other mods are? The good mods you guys talk about are honest, loyal, and they actually care about TTC. Maybe I don't agree with everything the other mods do, and maybe the rules are strict, but I like TTC because that's where I met some of my greatest friends and had some of my greatest times. I wanted to help TTC, I did not become a mod solely to inflict damage upon the other mods. The other mods, in fact, have been extremely sweet to me and you know, they're regular people, also. They're just trying to be professional. Maybe they do some unfair things, but they don't want to be mean.

I'm hurt, to an extent, that you guys expect me to break the rules just because you want me to.

I'm not trying to be mean I promise, I just wanted to be one of those "good mods" and be everyone's friend at the same time. ;__; I'm sorry if I sound whiny I'm just a big old party pooper djfhsdjkfh

Lucy, I understand what you're trying to say, and I'm fine that you don't want to break the rules. But if the mods talk shit about us behind our backs, they're the ones in the wrong.

We're actually trying to help TTC, if you think about it. We need to make the mods realise that they are in the wrong, and we need to give them a wake up call somehow. Yes, we are putting TTC at risk in losing a shitload of members, but it'll take whatever it takes for the mods to realise to change their ways.

One thing I don't understand is why they're not allowed to say anything about users. If it's private and it doesn't concern anyone but themselves, I think it's fine. What's wrong is when they openly flame other users and gossip visibly on the forums. And I mean, we're doing the same thing -- gossiping.

I think the only thing wrong is that sometimes they do unfairly ban a user, or inflict punishment on those who don't deserve it. But they're just people.

You guys have to understand that I'm not trying to deflect everything you say, I mean, like I said -- mods don't do everything in the favor of the users and they do make rash mistakes. Everyone does. Sometimes they confuse me and irritate me as well... ugh I'm so confused with myself, but this whole business with usernotes...

I can't give them to anyone now. I no longer have access to them. Even if I still did, I wouldn't. I'm sorry. ;_; but I still want to be everyone's friend and I hope you guys aren't mad at me for this. I just don't see what's so bad about the mods.

Tomothy wrote:Lucy, I understand what you're trying to say, and I'm fine that you don't want to break the rules. But if the mods talk shit about us behind our backs, they're the ones in the wrong.

We're actually trying to help TTC, if you think about it. We need to make the mods realise that they are in the wrong, and we need to give them a wake up call somehow. Yes, we are putting TTC at risk in losing a shitload of members, but it'll take whatever it takes for the mods to realise to change their ways.

This.

And you're just a big old party pooper djfhsdjkfh

I do want TTC to be a better place. We can't just barge in and say "YOU MODS ARE FUDGING MORONS AND THE SITE IS CORRUPT" though. I was banned very unrightfully (even though that isn't a word) so, and I just felt I deserved a bit more comfort that I didn't need TTC. I honestly from a selfish standpoint did sort of expect that one of my good friends that actually became a mod would maybe be able to help me out there a bit and hopefully it was the one I've known a lot longer but eh. I really don't care. I've given up on anything to do with TTC, whether I have good or bad intentions...good being showing the mods their wrongs (aka: so wait...you've been doing THIS -shows evidencesz0rs and shit like we're phoenix wright- and been moderating in such a cruel way in breaking the hearts of many kids?) and trying to suggest ways to fix them, bad being, "Fuck you, hey everybody stick THIS in your juicebox and suck on it!"...at first my blind rage wanted bad. Very badly. -pun- Now I've started to want good more than bad, but y'know, yeah. YEAH. THAT'S RIGHT. Not saying that they haven't deserved the bad lately. I've never laughed harder than seeing that thread Ryan and Diddy posted.

I understand you wanting to have good intentions - hey, if the mods weren't jerkoffs I would've had good intentions whilst being a mod too - but whatever, I'm done with TTC. I personally think we should start to put some of this behind us. We've gotten good from TTC - we met each other and all of that gooey stuff (no twss responses necessary to this serious post, thanks), and we showed everyone how pimp we are. We got this place to keep us together, even though we aren't all into the same thing anymore. And Lucy, it's nice to see you not lurking the site and posting for a change. ;D

[/endopinion]

Added note: Oh, and Lucy, since you just replied as I was writing my own, and you honestly can't see ANYTHING wrong with the mods, I will give a very short list:
-They thought that me not liking LEAF Clan myself while someone else said a negative opinion too and received nothing was good enough to destroy the entire TTCT and TCCL community. Honestly, without me, TTCT and TCCL really lack the enthusiasm and spirit. Tepcat may have said once I'm the brains and Aust is the spirit, but really, at the end of the day, it really fell on if I was there. Not trying to sound selfish even though this really is, but I put my back into those things and the only thing I gained was a lot of friends and a stab in the back.
-They have made other awful decisions in the past. You may have a point in we're all human, but so many critical errors you cannot give them a pardon for that.
-Off with our heads if we say anything even semi QUESTIONABLE, even if it wouldn't be questioned in real life -- they, meanwhile, have loudmouthed some users and, from what I've heard, cuss more than we do. And that's saying something!

Could think of more but I'll spare you the sob story. I honestly prefer Steam anyways, more variety

Also, I've repped everybody who I've felt has made a good point in posts in the topic. Enjoy the mass rep all :3

I'll admit, I never got involved in much and I never really saw any of the trouble first-hand (besides that whole RP forum thing).

But even still, it's not that I see the mods as perfect. It's just that I don't think they're as bad as everyone makes them out to be.

I understand wanting to point out that you're upset with the mods, but I mean, you could do that without all this! All you need is a PM with Bat telling him what you think is wrong. You guys sound like you have a lot to bring up without getting everyone involved. Like I said, the mods should be allowed to say what they want in private, just like we're allowed to. And trust me, if you guys asked me to keep a secret, I would carry it to my grave!
But yeah, wanting to make TTC a better place is a lot better than trying to take down the mods as a whole. I probably wouldn't get involved, since I don't like to get involved with stuff like that, especially if I was a mod also.

And Batleth has said this: he knows that TTC rules aren't for everyone. Commonly it is strict and sometimes it's unfair, but it's been fun for us, and I think it's admirable that you're putting everything behind you that easily, Zane !

... This post sounded a lot better in my head, I left out a lot but I think I've pretty much made the points I want to, I hope ;3;

Mmm, thanks. I probably will go back and forth somewhat but really I was done mid Summer... lol

I think I agree that we should just put TTC behind us. It's in the past, it sucks now, it's no longer worth going to. Yadda yadda. Heck, it may even be a combination of all that and that we've simply grown out of it.

One of Raxz's ramblings:

i know this topic is pretty much over and done with but i really have to put my two cents worth in! forgive me if i repeat something somebody has already said...i read all of the replies but sometimes i don't actually "read" them you know?

ANYWAYS. i know we put down the mods alot. i mean, like it's almost 24/7. i'm pretty sure in my last post i made fun of beaniemooch! the thing is, we all have our own personal experiences and we're all pissed about certain things that mods have done to us and we all want a little dirt on the mods to throw back in their face.

but could you imagine what having those usernotes would be like? it would be complete and utter chaos. at first i thought, "hell to the ya this is a beautiful idea" and then i realized...what happens when we actually read what the mods think of us? most of you think that you probably wouldn't care what they had to say about you but are you really sure? i probably wouldn't even be in the usernotes (as i'm not really that well known to the mods) but if i was and they had written something bad about me, i would NOT be happy. i'd probably feel like complete and utter crap. it would probably start a lot of drama between us even and i'm sure we'd ending up spreading the usernotes around to other users, etc. etc. and it'd be a big huge mess.

i'm sorry lucy, for pressuring you into getting those usernotes. i can't really speak for everybody else here but i wasn't thinking when i told you i wanted you to get them.

let's just continue to poke fun at the mods for some of their silly judgements because lord knows they've made them. usernotes are not needed ;D (i'm sure you've all come to this conclusion already, just my two cents).

Hey, I could have left everything as it was, there was no need to really even come back here. But some part of me felt like something wasn't complete, and that really the mods could hear from us that something they were doing was wrong. That did not need usernotes. But if we actually had usernotes, usernotes that made the mods look like they were keeping a whole world of information away from us, our argument would be based more strongly on something. When Mcstink discovered the usernote from melody it was already apparent mods were hiding their little conversations from us. Scarily similar to the way we used to do it way back then from others.

I'm no longer the kind of guy who quietly leaves a place and then vents voraciously about it behind the back of someone, even if I feel an almost inhuman contempt for them. I criticize people behind their backs. But when I want to strongly criticize someone, it becomes necessary to communicate to them directly. usernotes would have been convenient as the first message I sent to batleth with vulgar usernotes (via screenshot) could directly send the message that what they were doing was wrong. again, it wasn't necessary, just convenient.

btw robber, I never wanted to pressure you into doing anything. if you didn't want to collect usernotes, that would have been fine. sorry bout all that.

Raxz wrote:Happens to forums all the time -- the older they are the more ruined they are. You see, in almost every forum the userbase grows with time, and the size of the userbase is directly proportional to the stupidity of said userbase, because let's face it, most people on the Internet are just plain dumb in some way or another. The more users and general stupidity, the more mods, the more mods, the higher chances of having corrupt mods.

There's only a few ways to avoid this inevitable forum deterioration:

1: You can have a validation system -- people have to post in the validation forum before they can have a full account, so that the admin(s) in charge of approving users can verify whether you're worth having on the forum.

2: You can have an extremely exceptional site staff. I don't know how they do it, but there's this one forum I go to that somehow actually manages to avoid this deterioration simply because their staff are awesome. It should be impossible. But somehow they're pulling it off.

3: This is the simplest way; have your forum be invite-only, like Burrrr. Then you know only worthwhile people will be able to get in and there will only rarely be any major problems.

What we need to remember is that TTC is a part of our childhoods. I don't want to see the staff and site descend into madness, just like most other old sites. At the moment, TTC is rushing head first into a shithole of a site, and I don't want to see such a majorish part of my late childhood go down in such a way. I'm not active there anymore, and after I get banned I won't be, but TTC needs to pull their socks up if they want to regain their reputation as the best ever TTC fansite.